Master airbrushes ?

[DavidTHM]

I just saw a set of Master airbrushes ,6 of them as a set,and the price seems good but I know nothing about them. Does anyone have any experience with them? Good, Bad, in between? Arre they worth buying?

[Bubba]

They are Chinese made Iwata clones (right down to part interchangeability). Their level of "finish" varies wildly, as do the materials they are made from on nearly a daily basis. Their needles and nozzles are usually really rough, and the plating is almost universally poor compared to the real deal.

I have heard of people getting good results with them, but these smart folks basically gutted the "business" parts like needles, nozzles, air caps, triggers, etc. and replaced them with OEM Iwata parts anyhow. At that point, I'm not sure how much a person really saves over getting a "real" one.

Also, depending on where you get them, the prices can vary hugely as well. Sometimes you'll see a single brush for $15, and other times, the same one for $40+...

They have also sprouted a cottage industry of "airbrush re-hab technicians", who use their very cheaply available spare parts to refurbish old brushes either as a "service" to customers who are out of warranty, then charge for original parts, OR they are buying up old/worn/broken Iwatas, putting in Master (or other "off brand") parts, and flipping them as new... Those guys really pi$$ me off, especially when a couple of them are "names" in airbrushing. At least Master doesn't try to hide what they are...

I guess from where I look at it, even if they were awesome pieces of equipment, the scruples involved in their production and marketing puts them on par with recasters, which they essentially are.

[razorwyre1]

i taught airbrushing at my local micheals, and i used to cringe whenever a student brought in one of these Chinese imitations. it was very frustration when trying to teach someone how to get good results, when the airbrush itself is sabotaging those efforts. if a well made airbrush sputters, there are things that can be done to fix that, but with one of these imitations, its simply doing that because its poorly made, and nothing can be done to correct that.
do yourself a favor, and stick with one of the main brands.

[lugnut]

They have also sprouted a cottage industry of "airbrush re-hab technicians", who use their very cheaply available spare parts to refurbish old brushes either as a "service" to customers who are out of warranty, then charge for original parts, OR they are buying up old/worn/broken Iwatas, putting in Master (or other "off brand") parts, and flipping them as new... Those guys really pi$$ me off, especially when a couple of them are "names" in airbrushing. At least Master doesn't try to hide what they are...

Brad, can you "out" the guys who are doing this?? Amazing what some guys will do for a couple bucks......

[Bubba]

They have also sprouted a cottage industry of "airbrush re-hab technicians", who use their very cheaply available spare parts to refurbish old brushes either as a "service" to customers who are out of warranty, then charge for original parts, OR they are buying up old/worn/broken Iwatas, putting in Master (or other "off brand") parts, and flipping them as new... Those guys really pi$$ me off, especially when a couple of them are "names" in airbrushing. At least Master doesn't try to hide what they are...

Brad, can you "out" the guys who are doing this?? Amazing what some guys will do for a couple bucks......

Let me just say that A) Larry B. isn't the only scammer to use the word "Mojo", and B) If the company has a name that consists of letters, as opposed to a name, you'll find them...

These are NOT people who have any "fingers" in the GK world (well, other than pressing their "AB" reputation!) but still should be avoided, because they are cheap, greedy bastards cashing in on the lack of knowledge of the populace at large...

Other than that, Bill... "No! "

[lugnut]

Let me just say that A) Larry B. isn't the only scammer to use the word "Mojo", and B) If the company has a name that consists of letters, as opposed to a name, you'll find them...

hmm...who could that be? Thanks for the heads up!

[DavidTHM]

Thanks guys, I had a feeling that was the case, with these things, since for as long as I have been hanging around the hobby I had never heard of them. So even though the price is good I will pass and stick with my Iwata.

[Mob Scene]

Hmmm, this is interesting information. I haven't been tapped in to all the info that goes around, that's why I like this site, you never know what you can learn..
I stumbled across these Master Airbrushes through a friend, and yes the price was right and seemingly these guns were direct manufacturer's copies of Iwata. I figured it was like any other product, i.e. Sony owning Samsung or RCA and Proscan(I'm not sure if these company crossovers are accurate, just using an example).
Anyway, I've had moderate success with these brushes, but I have noticed an increasing state of difficulty in getting these to be reliable. I first chalked it up to shooting heavy, sticky materials through it but now I might be thinking differently. They aren't terrible but I never owned an actual Iwata, always used my trusty Paasche's, so I guess I can't truly compare to the real deal. I am however concerned about the shady business practices more than anything. I bought my gear from an online company called TCP Global, so I'm wondering if this place is part of the problem?
They've actually been very good on the customer service end of things: sending me a brand new replacement airbrush, when the one i ordered did not work, and not asking for the first airbrush to be returned. It was later discovered that there was just a small faulty part that once replaced with an Iwata part, worked perfectly. In writing all that now, it seems obvious theses airbrushes probably aren't quality controlled.
So is this one of the companies to look out for? I might have to switch over to the real deal so as to avoid any further frustration..
Best of luck to all you painters, may your brushes never clog..

Mike

[gordman43]

You truly get what you pay for when you buy an airbrush. Great quality is worth every penny.

[Bubba]

Master airbrushes are made by Fengda, and branded "Master" exclusively for TCP Global. Fengda also make "Veda" and other off brand clones, but the only place you can get Master is either direct from TCP, or buying one used. Of course TCP will send you a replacement for free. The airbrush costs them less than the shipping. Everything else that needs to be said about them is in the posts above...

Until recently (a month ago or so), I've referred people to TCP, (for other stuff, like parts and compressors) but I won't be doing that again.

[shakey dave 187]

I've only ever ordered comart paint from TCP.
And Io have to say their customer service is great,never had any problems on that end. The only problem I've had is everytime I order more than 10 bottles from them,one (always everytime) is the wrong color.
But now I know to stay away from their brushes,or all together when I find another place to order comart.

[tvspaintwerks]

Hhhmmm...? Guess I'll be going a different route on this. Like a few others on this post, I have used TCP Global for years and (hope I'm not shooting myself here) will most likely continue to do so. They have always provided me with excellent support, products in stock, best price, etc., etc.. And to make matters worse, I regularly use "Master Airbrushes". I've had excellent results with them - I have not one complaint.

Now, with that said, I do not say they give the same results as my "Iwata", nor are they as dependable. I do however recognize I am dealing with a $40 AB and do not expect, nor should I expect, to achieve the same results I do with a $300 Iwata. I think "Master" airbrushes have their place - but that "place" will be different based on each user. It's just as easy for me to put on a base coat, with a $40 brush, than it is to put it on with a $300 brush.

If you can afford the $300 AB's, great, but if the $300 is too much for you - heck yea, go with the "Master" and see how it works out for you! If it turns out to be junk, if it turns out to be less than expected, if it turns out you don't like it, you lost $40. But the money you lost, you've gained in experience and knowledge. But on the other hand, if it works for you, you just saved yourself $260. AB's I don't think are modern marvels of technology, in general they are pretty simple devices, yes, tiny little parts, but as most will confirm, keeping them clean (any of them) is a big factor in how they perform.

[Bubba]

...Now, with that said, I do not say they give the same results as my "Iwata", nor are they as dependable. I do however recognize I am dealing with a $40 AB and do not expect, nor should I expect, to achieve the same results I do with a $300 Iwata. I think "Master" airbrushes have their place - but that "place" will be different based on each user. It's just as easy for me to put on a base coat, with a $40 brush, than it is to put it on with a $300 brush.

That's great, IF you already know what to expect from any piece of equipment, and know how to fix it well enough to do what you want to with it. The thing is, for literally a few bucks more, you can buy a "legit" brush that will be even more dependable than a knock-off. If you decide you are going to keep airbrushing, you can always upgrade. Plus, you have the advantage of consistent quality, warranty service, and parts availability. I never said you couldn't get a "Master" or other knock-off to work, sometimes even well. The issue I have (leaving "principle" out of the equation) is that at their price point, their most likely buyers are going to be people who are completely new to airbrushing, who will likely think that they, and NOT the sub-par equipment is the issue, when that is not the case. CAVEAT EMPTOR!!!

Not only that, but when you send your legit brush to (insert alphabet soup seller here) for warranty service (as they claim to honor mfgr's warranties), how do you know the stuff they are "fixing" your brush with are actual mfgr parts? That's an awesome deal! Buy an Iwata, but get a Master's "guts" instead. NICE!!!

If they wanted to make a legitimate impression, they'd use those brushes as business cards, and give 'em away for free...

I'm not going to say that you shouldn't do business with TCP Global/ Airbrush Depot. What I will say is that you should KNOW what you are buying first, when it comes to airbrushes, especially their "house label". If you need to go to them for paint, compressors, whatever, I get it, but I (for what that's worth) WILL NOT recommend them to anybody for ANY airbrush purchases, as their ENTIRE BRAND is built on deception. Their service is (from all reports I've read/heard) great, but keep in mind also that the "airbrush thing" is their attempt to cash in on "Kustom Kulture", and their auto/cycle parts and tins are where their "bread and butter" is...

[tvspaintwerks]

Why, why, why? Wht does it seem that so many times an individual asks a perfectly legitimate question and so many times it is turned into a speech about who is, or isn't a "knock-off"? Who is to determine what a "legit" brush is versus a "knock-off" anyway?

So, I suppose there are folks out there buying the cheap, knock-off "Wal-Mart" brand of T-Shirts, when they should have bought the "real" Fruit of the Looms. Or maybe the "Hyndai" shouldn't be driven because it is just a Toyota "Knock Off" or perhaps every pick-up truck out there is a cheap "knock-off" because the first was a "Ford"? Or how about the modular houses that people buy and live in every day should all be boycotted because they are just cheap "knock-offs" of real houses? The list goes on and on, and based on your theory, 95% of what you own could be considered a "knock-off" from something developed by someone else, a long time ago! It's ridiculous...

What may I ask makes "Master" a "knock-off", versus the Iwata, Badger, H&S, Testors, Devilbiss or any other airbrush. It is a different brand - built for affordability - what in the heck is wrong with that? All the above mentioned airbrushes were not invented in the same miracle overnight! The brands and equipment all didn't just "magically" appear. No, an original airbrush was invented, and all of the forementioned companies followed with their version of the tool. So does that make them ALL "knock-offs" cause they weren't the "original"? If we all were "obligated" to buy nothing but true, first of their kind, "one and onlys", top brand, best of the best, we'd be lucky to have enough money left over to eat! Oh, wait, I can't do that either cause the "Burger King" down the street is just a "knock off" from the original McDonalds! Great, now what... At what point can we consider other factors such as variety, affordabilty, ingenuity, cost effectivness, etc., etc. rather than everything having to be a "knock-off"?

The question here wasn't about the history of "Master" airbrushes - question was - were they any good. Wether you like it or not, they are perfectly usable airbrushes and an exceptional value considering the options.

[Bubba]

...What may I ask makes "Master" a "knock-off", versus the Iwata...

The "perfectly legitimate" answer is because they are a direct, copyright/trademark/patent infringing copy of Iwata brushes, right down to part interchangeability (although TCP denies it!). The ONLY way they get away with it is that The People's Republic of China does NOT recognize ANY international Intellectual Property laws. They (Fengda) added a completely useless rubber seal (which CANNOT be replaced, because it doesn't need to be) so they could comply with US trade regulations.

Buy and use what you want. I'm passing no judgment on you, only the people selling them in the US who should know better, and if they were truly "customer oriented", simply wouldn't...

The "finer" points of your argument above, while "easy to chew" are hard to swallow. There is no "theory" involved. Each of the brands you mention above (except, oddly enough, WalMart) have their own unique, individual, and readily identifiable differences that actually DO distinguish them from their competitors, and there is (well, mostly) a reason for the attendant cost associated with them.

If you could "source" airbrushes to one person, Bernoulli would be the guy, and he'd be an undead bazillionair by now, seeing as how he "invented" his principle (much like Lou Gehrig invented A.L.S. ).

Lastly, the OP question was if Master airbrushes were any "good". Because they have almost (by your own words) represented a "value" for you, that does not mean that a consensus of users would share your experience, and the information I have seen and heard (especially if you are new to airbrushing!) is that they would NOT! If you get one, and it does what it is supposed to, well, LUCKY YOU!!! Buy another one!!! Hell, for the wholesale on them, I'd sell them myself, except that I won't sell anything I wouldn't pay the same money for myself!

Do what you gotta do... Peace...

[Heavy Metal Spike]

..........

.

[Pun13]

You truly get what you pay for when you buy an airbrush. Great quality is worth every penny.

A statement that could not be any more true than what it is.


Tom

[moviedemon]

I've had all kinds of ABs - cheap and expensive. And I've had some low end brushes that performed admirably. But the fact is, I found airbrushing a somewhat frustrating experience until I was able to afford one that cost more than $200.

That being said, I've experienced what kind of felt like airbrush elitism, where people would basically say "if you can't afford to buy an Iwata CH (or whatever), don't even bother."

While it was probably meant to be in my best interest, I found that sentiment far more discouraging than struggling to learn airbrushing with a cheap brush.

So personally, I say buy the best you can afford and, as was mentioned earlier, be aware of the limitations of an inexpensive brush. And don't underestimate the importance of practice. I've seen guys do amazing things with an old Paasche model H.

[Heavy Metal Spike]

A statement that could not be any more true than what it is ...

OK Tom - after all the years we've known one-another - I have to ask - are you in any way related to Eric Morecambe or Ernie Wise?

(* you'll have to do your own research there buddy *)

.

[Pun13]

A statement that could not be any more true than what it is ...

OK Tom - after all the years we've known one-another - I have to ask - are you in any way related to Eric Morecambe or Ernie Wise?

(* you'll have to do your own research there buddy *)

.

Nah... Maybe Eric the Red ....

I have had my share of airbrushes experiences (Good and Bad) until I settled on what I use now.
I use three airbrushes, that quite frankly see me using until the day I am planted 6 feet under.

Tom