THE CLUBHOUSE

OK, I am coming in late but I hope to give the OTHER side of this "Toe Argument". And I feel VERY STRONGLY about it.

Steve's otherwise accurate bio-mechanics aside - this is a DEMON!

The rules of nature don't apply to it - in fact, what makes the "Two-Toed" foot look MUCH BETTER to me is the uneasy feeling you get seeing it ... its ... UNNATURAL ... not supposed to be there ... its DISTURBING - which is what you WANT the DEMON to evoke in the viewer.

If you give it a three-toed clawed foot - it immediately detracts from that because it makes its foot LOOK like a Chicken or a Dinosaur or something ... FAMILIAR ... and NOT as a freakin' scary DEMON from Heck.

That's why I think the two-toed foot is a much better choice for this creature than the "ordinary" three-toed foot.


Anyhow ... whatever you go with Joe is gonna look GREAT either way ... but I felt I should at least give my side.

More grist.

Thanks for jumping in Vlad — and for putting it so well.

You’ve articulated that wrongness, when deliberate, can be the right design move. I appreciate the reminder that this creature may not be beholden to natural law — maybe it’s supposed to feel off, invasive, maybe even a bit inexplicable. There’s real design power in creating discomfort, and the two-toed version does feel more disturbing in its unnaturalness. At least if that's Joe's intention. But is it a demon? Is it supernatural? I didn't assume that. I feel it is a fantastical animal subject to natural laws. I guess that's for Joe to decide.

Even if it is "Unnatural" features only really work if the rest of the sculpt supports them. A demon can break the usual rules of anatomy — that's part of the appeal — but those weird parts still need to feel like they belong together, or that they’re strange on purpose. If everything else about the creature looks realistic, a really odd foot might just look out of place or like a mistake.

Using something unsettling can be very effective, but it’s also risky. It can make the creature feel powerful and eerie — or it can just confuse people, depending on how well the whole design ties together.

Also, saying a three-toed foot looks too much like a bird or dinosaur assumes that most viewers will make that connection. Some might — but others will just see a "cool monster foot" and not think twice about it. Perhaps Vlad you have the view you do because you spend a lot of time looking at theropod dinosaurs.

Great supernatural creatures don’t ignore real anatomy—they reinterpret it. Designers start by studying skeletons, joints, and muscle flows of real animals. This anatomical foundation gives structure and ensures even supernatural limbs, wings, or claws feel believable. And even if your goal is to unsettle, grounding the weirdness in believable anatomy can make that discomfort feel earned rather than arbitrary. Even supernatural beings benefit from structural coherence — muscles and bones (real or invented) give weight and agency to form. Both the Cyclops and Balrog, of which Joe's creation is a fusion, adheres to these principles.

This kind of back-and-forth is exactly why I love this board.

Steve - Agree 110 pct with what you said regarding the back and forth on this board.

I can't disagree with any of your comments, I just wanted to convey the feeling that I got the very first time that I saw that bash put together with the two-toed foot.

I found it disturbingly freaky and I think that works due to the weirdness of this bash.

BTW, by the length of our posts on this topic, any visitor should be able to instantly tell that one of us is retired, and the other one not far behind!

Can't argue with that! Cheers Vlad!

Well, you guys have certainly each made a very good case for 3 or 2 toes respectively.
I sincerely appreciate the very helpful feedback and considerations !

I am currently leaning towards sticking with 2 , mainly because his hands only have 2 fingers (not counting the thumb).

Got the left new left arm roughed in and swapped in much larger claws.
I think the left side profile is 100% better with the new arm position, and overall he is looking much fiercer.

Joe, the extra long claws on the L hand really do add to the fierceness of this character ... they also make me feel uneasy looking at it ... like its saying: "pick your poison - death by axe or by clawing" Yikes!!!

As far as the feet go - he will look "A+" either way!!! (I've cast my vote )

Keep going (Meanwhile, I am stuck at this screen ... making $$$ on the weekend ... no modeling before Dallas ...)

P.S. Will post some photos from the game!!!

barad_dur wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2025, 4:50 pm I think the left side profile is 100% better with the new arm position, and overall he is looking much fiercer.

Yeah, that left hand is a substantial improvement. Will this require changes to the right hand or will their disparity (I can't tell if there is any) be consider as asymmetry? A battleaxe hand and a slashing hand? Because such a slashing hand, given the size of the claws may not be the best arrangement to hold an axe. Has it evolved or been engineered this way? I dunno, I'm just winging it here.

Squidy53 wrote: ↑August 3rd, 2025, 3:10 am

barad_dur wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2025, 4:50 pm I think the left side profile is 100% better with the new arm position, and overall he is looking much fiercer.

Yeah, that left hand is a substantial improvement. Will this require changes to the right hand or will their disparity (I can't tell if there is any) be consider as asymmetry? A battleaxe hand and a slashing hand? Because such a slashing hand, given the size of the claws may not be the best arrangement to hold an axe. Has it evolved or been engineered this way? I dunno, I'm just winging it here.

Heh, I'll answer that one FOR Joe. With the right hand closed into a fist, the (smaller) claws are not really visible. Leave that one alone, Joe!!!

bucketfoot-al wrote: ↑August 3rd, 2025, 3:12 am Heh, I'll answer that one FOR Joe.

What? Are you guys joined at the hip now?

I don’t plan to do anything to the right hand, even though technically steve is absolutely correct in that it should have long claws too and that would make it difficult to hold an axe.

However, my guess is that 99.99 percent of the people who see this creature when it is finished will not even think about that disparity.
Unless of course they have followed this thread ….

Is the word for me "persnickety" or something less polite?

YES.

Added spikes down the back
Slimmed down left arm
Major changes are done, still some refining and detailing to do

Whoa! Those spikes really spice things up!

Thanks Trevor and Vlad! Yeah, spikes always add some nice visual interest

'Bout time we got some spikes!

Thanks for following this build Overspray!

Blending in the spikes and adding some skin nodules

Hey Steve - I made the claws longer on the axe hand , see second pic. Finger claws are not quite as long as left hand, but close.

Threw on some primer just to see it all tied together.

Usually at this stage I see something that needs a drastic change, but I gotta say that I am pretty happy with how he looks .
His backside haunches are bigger than I would prefer, but they are not irritating me enough to take on that big change (yet…)

Some minor refinement and detailing left to do , and then onto painting.